(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[AGA]SZ[19]KM[7.50]TM[5400]OT[5x60 byo-yomi]
GN[1st AGA-TYGEMGO Pro Finals - 7A, game 1]PW[Jianing Gan]PB[GanSheng Shi]WR[6d]BR[7d]DT[2012-08-03]PC[The KGS Go Server at http://www.gokgs.com/]US[Dennis Wheeler]C[mate105 [3d\]: 2nd pro ?
USGO1 [-\]: http://www.usgo.org/aga-professional-system
]RE[B+1.50]
;B[pd]
;W[dp]
;B[pq]
;W[dd]
;B[qk]
;W[jq]
;B[po]
;W[nc]
;B[pf]
;W[pb]
;B[qc]
;W[kc]
;B[cn]
;W[fp]
;B[cq]
;W[cp]
;B[bp]
;W[bo]
;B[bq]
;W[co]
;B[er]
;W[dj]
;B[lq]
;W[df]C[YangXu [4d\]: so if gan wins this and one more time, he becomes pro. and if gansheng wins this game, he becomes pro?
YangXu [4d\]: jianning*
]
;B[gq]C[Illyria [?\]: no, this is the first of a 3 game match
Illyria [?\]: both players need to win 2 games
YangXu [4d\]: thanks
]
;W[fr]
;B[fq]
;W[eq]
;B[dq]
;W[ep]
;B[gr]
;W[ho]
;B[bn]
;W[dn]
;B[dm]C[palapiku [-\]: easy game for gansheng :)
RobertT [-\]: gansheng seems to do a lot better in tournament games than he does online
]
;W[em]C[palapiku [-\]: he beat smartrobot online a few days ago
palapiku [-\]: as b without komi, though
Warfreak2 [4d\]: gansheng made andy liu's only loss in the whole pro exam
]
;B[en]C[ivank [3k\]: smartrobot blundered
palapiku [-\]: if i played smartrobot and he blundered, he would still win :)
]
;W[do]C[ivank [3k\]: =)
]
;B[el]C[palapiku [-\]: but yeah, it wasn't an even game
Arhiman [3d\]: why isn't Andy playing the finals ?
zeku [1k\]: Who is first pro? andy?
]
;W[fm]
;B[cl]C[Arhiman [3d\]: has been eliminated ?
RobertT [-\]: andy is already 1p
]
;W[an]C[RobertT [-\]: this is the game for the 2nd pro
Arhiman [3d\]: oh
palapiku [-\]: the finals are over, arhiman
palapiku [-\]: this is the losers' finals
]
;B[fl]C[Illyria [?\]: it's double elimination
]
;W[gm]C[RobertT [-\]: so 1 of these 2 players will be the 2nd pro
]
;B[gl]C[RobertT [-\]: andy is already the 1st one
Illyria [?\]: yes
]
;W[hl]C[Arhiman [3d\]: gansheng lost against liu ?
RobertT [-\]: yes, he lost
CrossKid [6d\]: made it in time!
palapiku [-\]: yes, 2-1 :(
Arhiman [3d\]: and lui has been eliminated twice 
Arhiman [3d\]: ?
Illyria [?\]: andy is very strong
palapiku [-\]: yes
]
;B[hk]C[Arhiman [3d\]: aww, I wanted Eric to be the 2nd :(
]
;W[il]
;B[am]C[CrossKid [6d\]: Eric Lui is seeded for next year though
]
;W[ao]C[gokoan [-\]: there will be mwkim comments?
RobertT [-\]: 90 minutes after this game started
RobertT [-\]: so in 1 hour
]
;B[bj]C[Illyria [?\]: eric's second game was really weird
ThiGar [3k\]: GanSheng Shi must be tired after his finals game with bbw
Illyria [?\]: it was like he decided to channel zchen
shika12 [?\]: I forgot about the US Open this year... wow
palapiku [-\]: yes, gansheng should have resigned earlier :)
]
;W[ci]C[CrossKid [6d\]: Mm :/ wish i gotta see zchen to play in the tournament too 
Illyria [?\]: yeah, I was sad he didn't come
ivank [3k\]: why?
]
;B[bi]
;W[ch]C[sedgwick [4d?\]: Jie Li also sadly missed
CrossKid [6d\]: he said he felt everyone was improving
CrossKid [6d\]: and that he wasnt 
ivank [3k\]: hmm
]
;B[ik]C[palapiku [-\]: i wonder what potential andy has to improve
CrossKid [6d\]: why could Jie Li not go? 
palapiku [-\]: he's been 9d for a long time now...
sedgwick [4d?\]: Don't know
]
;W[jl]C[CrossKid [6d\]: too bad
Illyria [?\]: both of them were invited
CrossKid [6d\]: Yeah they were the selected invites
]
;B[bl]C[viu30h [5k\]: when did the game start?
viu30h [5k\]: 20 min ago?
ivank [3k\]: yes
Sungod [1k?\]: andyboyawinall
]
;W[qm]C[palapiku [-\]: jianing is also a selected invite? he didn't win any qualifiers
sedgwick [4d?\]: He did win a spot from the Tygem online qualifying
Illyria [?\]: look at the link at the top of chat
palapiku [-\]: oh
palapiku [-\]: then http://www.usgo.org/aga-professional-system is wrong
palapiku [-\]: it doesn't mention him there
sedgwick [4d?\]: Gansheng is Canadian invite
]
;B[qo]C[CrossKid [6d\]: how did justin teng get in?
Illyria [?\]: it has him listed as Will Gan
Illyria [?\]: the site is right
palapiku [-\]: oh thanks
]
;W[ec]C[palapiku [-\]: does gansheng have a western name too?
CrossKid [6d\]: Ah nevermind he got in through tygem 
Hellhuman [1d\]: andi already pro?
viu30h [5k\]: yup
viu30h [5k\]: means 6 months no bbw games?
]
;B[bg]C[palapiku [-\]: only on tygem :)
cjheaven [8d\]: gansheng is called william
Hellhuman [1d\]: those players from usa with those asian names, 7ds
palapiku [-\]: will vs william
Hellhuman [1d\]: have they learned go in usa canada, or asia?
]
;W[qi]
;B[pl]
;W[oi]C[ThiGar [3k\]: It's amazing how high the Go ladder is! bbw is a 8-9d half-god on kgs, brand new AGA 1P, yet it was reported the korean pro who commented his game on Tygem said he made several slack moves!
viu30h [5k\]: pros make slack moves too
palapiku [-\]: i thought it was gansheng who made several slack moves
mpepe16 [6d\]: Andy is far from fresh 1p level.
]
;B[ph]C[viu30h [5k\]: 6 months korean drill will leave their mark
cjheaven [8d\]: andy is 1p level
]
;W[qj]
;B[rk]C[mpepe16 [6d\]: Are you sure?
]
;W[rg]C[ivank [3k\]: 8d>6d
palapiku [-\]: he seems to have two things, he's strong and he plays well in tournaments
mpepe16 [6d\]: I think this competition was way more easier than real exam in korea,china or even in japan.
]
;B[ok]C[CrossKid [6d\]: Having an easy exam doesnt make someone weaker...
gokoan [-\]: 1p level - america... cuz he still amateur compared with asians pros...
ThiGar [3k\]: oh well, it has the merit to start the whole pro system
palapiku [-\]: sure mpepe but he has a strong record in several big tournaments
huk: time will tell
huk: I suspect 6 months of kimchi will also leave their mark :)
CrossKid [6d\]: Which is why hes also going to korea to train for some time he will improve and come back 10 times as powerful :P
Vorador [-\]: you have to start somewhere....
]
;W[oj]C[CrossKid [6d\]: right 
mpepe16 [6d\]: And than he will be strong like a 1p.
]
;B[rf]
;W[qg]
;B[qf]C[mpepe16 [6d\]: But this seems strange.I mean this means lot of 6dan in europe can be pro.
Vorador [-\]: if the egc would do smth similar
]
;W[jf]C[cjheaven [8d\]: this tournament is easier
CrossKid [6d\]: They did
]
;B[ce]C[cjheaven [8d\]: but andy is much stronger than all of us
gokoan [-\]: yeah.. if they start trainning since 5 years old...
CrossKid [6d\]: europe had a pro exam 1 year as well 
mpepe16 [6d\]: Really?
palapiku [-\]: really?
]
;W[cd]C[viu30h [5k\]: no one passed?
mpepe16 [6d\]: Thats new for me.
CrossKid [6d\]: yeah 
ThiGar [3k\]: really? when?
CrossKid [6d\]: butthe players didnt take it seirously enough
CrossKid [6d\]: so i heard it was canceled early on
palapiku [-\]: ah..
Hellequin [13k\]: such a waste
mpepe16 [6d\]: Never heard about tho I'm european.
CrossKid [6d\]: well it was from kgs kibitz so
CrossKid [6d\]: i could be wrong
Illyria [?\]: the internet is never wrong
palapiku [-\]: how is b gonna reduce the top
viu30h [5k\]: i know there was the  euro go pro initiative or something but that got never sponsored really or something
CrossKid [6d\]: maybe that was it
CrossKid [6d\]: i just know they said some of the players took it as a joke
palapiku [-\]: i remember that one
palapiku [-\]: seemed like another one of breakfast's genius ideas
CrossKid [6d\]: either way It would be cool to see pros in europe and USA
huk: gotta keep trying though...one day it will all come together
CrossKid [6d\]: I am sure japan korea and china started the same way we did .... maybe with slightly stronger players :) but we all cant be genius
palapiku [-\]: we just need to get magnus carlssen to switch to go
viu30h [5k\]: really strong pros in usa and europe will develop the day they get a national insei system
viu30h [5k\]: thats gonna take a while
CrossKid [6d\]: that would be cool haha
viu30h [5k\]: we need more players that learn the game when there 6
]
;B[hg]C[ThiGar [3k\]: maybe kasparov is secretly training at go
palapiku [-\]: chess doesn't really have a national insei system, but there're lots of strong chess players
palapiku [-\]: so that's not it
Illyria [?\]: the main issue is how little recognition go gets in non-asian countries
viu30h [5k\]: chess players have easy access to chess and other chess players
palapiku [-\]: just need more popular support
gokoan [-\]: to become chess master is easy compared with go
palapiku [-\]: haha
palapiku [-\]: try it then
CrossKid [6d\]: Hm well personally I beleive the problem was specifically this
nemozetbit [3k?\]: sorry, i just joined. is there a live feed of this game?
CrossKid [6d\]: the pro system
CrossKid [6d\]: players learn the game and learn no matter how much they learn there only chance is to go to korea japan or china to earn a living off it 
gokoan [-\]: acttualy i hve a good rating in chess
]
;W[ig]C[cl3m7 [1k\]: you prefer black or white ?
CrossKid [6d\]: but they also have to take into consideration there limits and that it cost them more money to go there and take the pro exam than it does for actual korean china and japan players
gogol1er [1k\]: what level gokoan?
CrossKid [6d\]: so most players stop practicing and stop wanting to improve because there just is no point anymore
gokoan [-\]: 2100
palapiku [-\]: that's why i stopped doing everything :(
CrossKid [6d\]: so maybe we will see more improvement in the go system for U.S now that people can actualyl earn a living off it
ThiGar [3k\]: definitly
]
;B[kd]C[CrossKid [6d\]: otherwise i can see players saying "its not worth it"
gogol1er [1k\]: i don't have ratings anymore, but i have a title :-)
Illyria [?\]: the pro system here people aren't going to be able to live off of
Warfreak2 [4d\]: having a pro exam isn't going to do anywhere near as much as having a go school would
gokoan [-\]: nice ^^
palapiku [-\]: it's far from clear that andy or the winner of this game can make any more money by being pro
CrossKid [6d\]: Im not so sure about that Illyria 
palapiku [-\]: possibly they will be able to charge more for lessons
viu30h [5k\]: most go players get interested in go when there already older (compared to asia)
CrossKid [6d\]: they havent said anyhting about money for th epros yet 
palapiku [-\]: as i understand it most pros make money by teaching
CrossKid [6d\]: thats rightthey do
Illyria [?\]: I don't think there's any kind of salary involved
sedgwick [4d?\]: There is the teaching stipend (2000$) for those who teach at the congress
palapiku [-\]: and andy could possibly make a living that way
]
;W[jd]C[palapiku [-\]: he's famous enough
sedgwick [4d?\]: American qualified professionals would become eligible for this
Illyria [?\]: andy could already probably make a living doing that, without being pro
Akir [2k\]: its best not to count some elses money....
Karcusrd [-\]: The question here is not the pro worth but the worth aas an oganized event in the US
ThiGar [3k\]: chinese toddlers start on 5x5 :)
gogol1er [1k\]: unless you are top 10, it's better to become teacher
viu30h [5k\]: yeah us and european pros    then you could study games of people whose name you can actually remember and pronounce
]
;B[lc]
;W[jc]C[nemozetbit [3k?\]: n17 here?
gokoan [-\]: i prefer m16
Matsuyama [-\]: what is w account on kgs ?
Karcusrd [-\]: basicly the more Euro and US pro or near pro there is all the better in upper tournaments
gokoan [-\]: no.. m16 is bad
nemozetbit [3k?\]: so n17?
flintngun [3d\]: hkkyeen is w account
Matsuyama [-\]: ty
]
;B[gh]C[Karcusrd [-\]: So this will become as popular as Poker Stars
palapiku [-\]: hkkyeen is his account for the CGA online league
]
;W[ne]C[palapiku [-\]: dunno if he has one for normal games
]
;B[cf]C[gokoan [-\]: e13
]
;W[eg]C[ThiGar [3k\]: EuroGoTV is great on the net. Maybe a new Go tv will spring up in the US with the new US pros.
gokoan [-\]: ^^
]
;B[ff]C[Karcusrd [-\]: ThiGar that seems to be the plann
RobertT [-\]: ESPN 25
ThiGar [3k\]: ah!
Karcusrd [-\]: lol
viu30h [5k\]: espn?
]
;W[de]C[palapiku [-\]: poker is losing popularity.. replace all poker shows with go shows
viu30h [5k\]: xD
Karcusrd [-\]: better not be facebook
]
;B[nf]C[ThiGar [3k\]: in las vegas?
palapiku [-\]: why not
palapiku [-\]: the world go series at bellaggio
]
;W[mf]C[RobertT [-\]: magic the gathering was on ESPN before in its boom
gokoan [-\]: facebook age is dying
Karcusrd [-\]: cheapen some what
RobertT [-\]: and that's a trading card game :p
]
;B[ng]C[viu30h [5k\]: magic is THE trading card game
]
;W[mj]C[Lacron [1k\]: And Go is THE borad game ;)
Karcusrd [-\]: no Govision
Lacron [1k\]: *board
palapiku [-\]: go tournament with $1,000,000 buy-in
]
;B[mg]C[RobertT [-\]: go tournaments need helmet mounted cams
]
;W[lf]C[Warfreak2 [4d\]: pokemon is THE trading card game
Karcusrd [-\]: Govision come get some Go
ThiGar [3k\]: lol
]
;B[oe]
;W[nd]C[palapiku [-\]: glass board, special camera under the table to show the board from below
gokoan [-\]: lol
]
;B[ip]C[ThiGar [3k\]: man, ideas are plenty!
RobertT [-\]: go needs more camera angles
Karcusrd [-\]: and yes you can rattle the stones
palapiku [-\]: oh man that would be so great for nigiri
viu30h [5k\]: the bird view is most important
RobertT [-\]: nigari vision lol
palapiku [-\]: nigiri vision =)
ThiGar [3k\]: infrared nigiri
palapiku [-\]: jianing drew five stones.... can gansheng guess?? let's find out after the commercial break!
yithril [-\]: so wait this is it?
yithril [-\]: Andy Liu and one of these guys?
Illyria [?\]: yep
viu30h [5k\]: problem is whenever yoda norimoto is invited to a pro tourney in us he will break the glass goban
KurataSan [1d\]: Andy Liu became a pro??
palapiku [-\]: yes
Warfreak2 [4d\]: he did
Warfreak2 [4d\]: using power strength
palapiku [-\]: six years too late
gokoan [-\]: where is usgo?
RobertT [-\]: this tournament brough to you by 5 hour energy. have the power to last through study sessions.
Karcusrd [-\]: lol
Nosabe [-\]: dinner break ?
Illyria [?\]: internet problems
palapiku [-\]: 9p would have the best stone tricks
RobertT [-\]: dinner break is still an hour away
Karcusrd [-\]: and gieco so easy a caveman can atari
palapiku [-\]: flicking stones between fingers
Nosabe [-\]: ok
Nosabe [-\]: thanks
RobertT [-\]: even a caveman defends agenst a peep
ThiGar [3k\]: The Gostones replace the Flintstones
RobertT [-\]: the new u.s. pro systems marketing department should be kgs kibitzers
viu30h [5k\]: so you wanna sabotage the pro system since you coulndt be one?
Karcusrd [-\]: live!
gokoan [-\]: wht is a kibitzer?
viu30h [5k\]: you are one
RobertT [-\]: you are a kibitzer
gokoan [-\]: what the term mean?
Karcusrd [-\]: we can only hire three of you who wants the exam first?
RobertT [-\]: a person that kibitz
gokoan [-\]: wht is to kibitz?
omizu [6k\]:  i alo want to know
RobertT [-\]: something that a kibitzer does
Nosabe [-\]: it's amazing they choose these guys to be pros, when all of the kibitzers are smarter players
roussos [2k\]: look it up on senseis.xmp.net
Karcusrd [-\]: talk here is Kibitzing
RobertT [-\]: horray for circle definitions
RobertT [-\]: for A see B, for B see A
ThiGar [3k\]: lol a new pro kibitzer system to accompany the players
roussos [2k\]: http://senseis.xmp.net/?Kibitz
omizu [6k\]:  is this game ongoing?
Nosabe [-\]: need " color " announcers and " play by play " announcers
Becri [6k\]:  
Karcusrd [-\]: does this mean the US has how many pro?
baian [1d\]: "they both really came to play today !"
omizu [6k\]: is this game sill going on ?
Nosabe [-\]: now you're talking
RobertT [-\]: after this tournament there will be 2 aga certified pros
ThiGar [3k\]: it's still a very small family!
Karcusrd [-\]: thanks
ligo [4k\]: gotta play this one move at a time
RobertT [-\]: but there are other americans that have become pros through asian certification
Susaku [-\]: hey nosa XD
Nosabe [-\]: hi
RobertT [-\]: and other pros that have moved to the u.s. after being pros
vitamancy [9k\]: "It looks like this is the kind of go game where you are just going to have to outscore you opponent to win."
ThiGar [3k\]: yes, including a Nihon Kin 9p!
roussos [2k\]: Michael Redmond is 9p
Ganymed [7k\]: Someone should update senseis, it still says Andy's an amateur
shipshape [?\]: *** Live commentary will be provided for this match on the Korea 1 server on TYGEMGO starting at 5:30pm EDT. http://www.tygembaduk.com
Ube [1k\]: can andy decline btw?
]
;W[lp]
;B[mq]C[roussos [2k\]: LOL :)
]
;W[hp]
;B[iq]
;W[hf]
;B[fg]
;W[nk]
;B[nl]
;W[ml]
;B[nm]C[roussos [2k\]: imagine that
]
;W[kp]
;B[io]
;W[mm]C[Susaku [-\]: Sabetsu   differentiation (n), discrimination (n,vs), distinction (n), Could it be Nosabe is really Nosabetsu but nosabe to alter meaning ?
]
;B[hn]C[Susaku [-\]: still this game looks interesting nonetheless
]
;W[in]C[Susaku [-\]: ... overplaying the f4 group atari by looks
Susaku [-\]: might be the motive
vitamancy [9k\]: motive of the h6 move?
Susaku [-\]: maybe
Susaku [-\]: not 100% might also see how w replys
]
;B[jn]
;W[im]
;B[gp]
;W[go]
;B[fo]
;W[fn]C[USGO1 [-\]: someone stole my ip address and bumped me off... had to log back in a catch up
Susaku [-\]: and it looks like my theory was right
Nosabe [-\]: they can't stop go !
Susaku [-\]: Curses usgo foiled me again!
Zachmura [3d\]: no video stream of this game, correct?
Karcusrd [-\]: USGOTV
ThiGar [3k\]: h3?
]
;B[ln]C[Nosabe [-\]: n6
Nosabe [-\]: man, i was close
Susaku [-\]: haha randomly thinking of negimashi atm...meaning Extra Spring Onions...
Ganymed [7k\]: I was thinking of N6, too. Why is M6 better?
Zachmura [3d\]: usgotv?
Nosabe [-\]: you got me
yithril [-\]: do either ofthese guys play on kgs?
Susaku [-\]: m6 n6 m5 n5 n4  maybe?
Susaku [-\]: a little simple but w might walk into it
cl3m7 [1k\]: time please ?
ThiGar [3k\]: or m6 n6 m9?
RobertT [-\]: yes, one of ganshengs account on kgs is Gifted
gokoan [-\]: seems like black is winning
ThiGar [3k\]: well-named account though not that humble
gokoan [-\]: n6 only move
KiritoArt: I think white is going to win
vitamancy [9k\]: is k5 an option?
gokoan [-\]: noo
zeku [1k\]: I think B+30
KiritoArt: k5 is hard because h3 is atari?
evanj [3d\]: i don't care who wins
evanj [3d\]: i'll have forgotten tomorrow anyway
RobertT [-\]: the ones I wanted to win have alredy been knocked out
ThiGar [3k\]: who were they?
palapiku [-\]: i wanted my mom to win
gokoan [-\]: jar jar binks
evanj [3d\]: your mom won last night, trust me
]
;W[mn]C[Muttley [2k\]: evanj, inappropriate
]
;B[mo]C[Ganymed [7k\]: Imho b has a slight advantage, but it still is exciting
Muttley [2k\]: didn't make me laugh either, which is much worse.
evanj [3d\]: :(
RobertT [-\]: calvin sun, bill lin and curtis tang where the players I was rooting for the most
Muttley [2k\]: :))
KiritoArt: how do you think black has an advantage?
gokoan [-\]: do u know hw to count?
KiritoArt: no
palapiku [-\]: :)
Ganymed [7k\]: b is leading in territory
KiritoArt: oh sure, there is that
]
;W[nn]C[Lynx [1d\]: b plays like a pinball wizard
KiritoArt: territory isnt very important though, when white has the shape he does.
ThiGar [3k\]: because of their styles, RT?
gokoan [-\]: lol... territory defines the victory.. so territory is very importabt in g
RobertT [-\]: because they are kgs trolls
gokoan [-\]: go*
]
;B[on]C[KiritoArt: p5 looks fun
Karcusrd [-\]: they become pro troll next week
palapiku [-\]: troll tournament in EGR
]
;W[om]
;B[no]C[cl3m7 [1k\]: q7
KiritoArt: Isnt this trade a bit much for black to give up?
]
;W[pm]
;B[rm]C[evanj [3d\]: he just showed you what's what
]
;W[ol]
;B[ql]C[ThiGar [3k\]: now bottom is huge!
gokoan [-\]: white should fix the tp
KiritoArt:  f10 or r18 seem rather large 
gokoan [-\]: top
Lynx [1d\]: as W, I would want to get something like g15
]
;W[qb]
;B[fd]
;W[gj]C[KiritoArt: ah
KiritoArt: I saw this, but wasnt sure
]
;B[fj]C[KiritoArt: does this work?
Nosabe [-\]: man ! this is it !
gooooo [3k?\]: who are playing
gokoan [-\]: black and white
ThiGar [3k\]: wasn't black e12 preferable to prepare f16?
]
;W[gd]C[KiritoArt: e12 isnt sente
bert [3d\]: p13 p14 s17 for w
]
;B[bd]C[shyfox [6k\]: close game
]
;W[bc]
;B[be]
;W[pg]
;B[rb]
;W[pc]C[Nosabe [-\]: hkkyeen and gifted
]
;B[ra]C[Warfreak2 [4d\]: hkkyeen is awsome
KiritoArt: s17 r16 s16 s15 t17 t15 t18 t16 r19 t19 s17 ?
RobertT [-\]: bill lin has beaten hkkyeen every time they play ^^"
gooooo [3k?\]: who are playing
KiritoArt: oh nvm
KiritoArt: ._.
cl3m7 [1k\]: not every time, be fair
gooooo [3k?\]: gokoan, that wasn't helpful
RobertT [-\]: oh he won once
RobertT [-\]: 1 out of 8
gooooo [3k?\]: nosabe, hk white?
RobertT [-\]: gj gan!
cl3m7 [1k\]: and you only check kgs RobertT, they play in tournaments too
KiritoArt: s17 r16 t16 works doesnt it?
KiritoArt: black cant block white at t13 area
gokoan [-\]: the name f the players is right in front of your eyes..
KiritoArt: so it would be like s17 r16 t16 s16 t14 ?
Yukontodd [7k?\]: w gan, b shi
Illyria [?\]: w is jianing gan, b is gansheng shi
RobertT [-\]: their kgs games are long time limit canadian league games
]
;W[fi]C[gooooo [3k?\]: thanks
Karcusrd [-\]: they are American pro
gokoan [-\]: they will be..
RobertT [-\]: not pro yet
]
;B[gi]C[KiritoArt: one will be
RobertT [-\]: and 1 of them wont be
]
;W[fk]C[Yukontodd [7k?\]: they are canadians one of whom will be pro
]
;B[hj]
;W[ej]
;B[gk]
;W[gf]C[Karcusrd [-\]: they are citizens of the US
KiritoArt: g15 
RobertT [-\]: u.s. or canada
Karcusrd [-\]: I dont know
Yukontodd [7k?\]: They're playing as canadians.
RobertT [-\]: its not a question karcusrd. u.s. or canadian citizens can play
RobertT [-\]: its not just u.s.
]
;B[ac]C[mateogo [3k\]: not mexican?
RobertT [-\]: not for now
mateogo [3k\]: autreageous
gokoan [-\]: not red indians?
]
;W[hi]
;B[fj]C[mateogo [3k\]: *
Yukontodd [7k?\]: Racist go player is racist.
RobertT [-\]: well we dont really have to worry about mexico for now since the top player is about kgs 4d....
Karcusrd [-\]: is the komi 0.5?
]
;W[dr]C[RobertT [-\]: even game
]
;B[fs]
;W[gj]C[Ganymed [7k\]: b+6 I think. seems like w thinks something like that, too
gokoan [-\]: u should worry about Brazilian players... they are gettin stronge
Susaku [-\]: 7.5 komi
Susaku [-\]: by looks
Karcusrd [-\]: oh bad komi
cl3m7 [1k\]: USGO1, please, what about the time of each players ? are they in byo yomi ?
Ganymed [7k\]: Options → Rules btw. Although the website said something about AGA rules with Japanese counting
]
;B[bb]C[RobertT [-\]: yes, its aga rules
RobertT [-\]: aga rules it doesnt matter if its chinese or japanese counting. both come out to the same score with aga regardless of how the game is played
Aokame [?\]: what happened to andy liu?
RobertT [-\]: he won
Aokame [?\]: usgo2?
RobertT [-\]: he is now the 1st pro
]
;W[ii]C[Aokame [?\]: is he pro now?
]
;B[fj]C[RobertT [-\]: this game decides the 2nd pro
klabauter [2d\]: Robert, even with weird seki's?
RobertT [-\]: err best of 3
Aokame [?\]: oh, nice
]
;W[fh]C[Karcusrd [-\]: pros in rows
RobertT [-\]: yes, the point of aga rules is to not matter between area and territory counting
Aokame [?\]: but whats this game about? i thought one canadian is already pro
Susaku [-\]: d13 maybe?
klabauter [2d\]: ic tx
ThiGar [3k\]: only if komi uneven (5.5  7.5  9.5...)
RobertT [-\]: this game is the 1st of a best of 3 to decide the 2nd pro
baian [1d\]: right this is best of 3 for secong pro slot
]
;B[db]C[Aokame [?\]: i see. where can i find the 3rd bbw game? usgo2?
evanj [3d\]: 1
Karcusrd [-\]: why arnt they 9d
Ganymed [7k\]: AGA has no 9d
Karcusrd [-\]: oh
]
;W[eb]
;B[ek]C[Demon [3d\]: karcusrd, it's not possible!  try it yourself.....
]
;W[gg]C[opium [?\]: its like watching First Kyu irl
RobertT [-\]: aga officially only goes up to 7d but the ratings go higher
]
;B[ea]C[Karcusrd [-\]: someone with more skills should
Hindor [2k\]: The game is played on tygem right ?
]
;W[fa]
;B[da]
;W[fc]C[Aokame [?\]: yeah opium, this is history
RobertT [-\]: so anyone 7.0+ in aga is considered 7d
Ganymed [7k\]: time to recount
Aokame [?\]: maybe they arent strong as asian pros, but its a start
vitamancy [9k\]: game seems to have swung toward W.
Karcusrd [-\]: do they have to be AGA 7d to test
RobertT [-\]: no
Karcusrd [-\]: excellent
RobertT [-\]: there where qualifying tournaments that happened the past couple months
]
;B[ap]
;W[eo]C[RobertT [-\]: the players in this tournament qualified
Susaku [-\]: so then if I wanted to I could test for it as well?
Susaku [-\]: not saying that I would atm

Karcusrd [-\]: I cant
Demon [3d\]: he can give occasional updates on how much time they each have left, but saying every move is extremely unreasonable
]
;B[km]
;W[hq]
;B[ir]C[ThiGar [3k\]: i still think e12 should have been played before f16]
;W[hr]
;B[hs]C[RobertT [-\]: yes, the in person tournaments had a rank requirment but the tygem online tournament was open to all
Susaku [-\]: interesting
RobertT [-\]: I competed in it and there where even ddks in the tournament (they got knocked out fast :p)
]
;W[rj]C[Aokame [?\]: what happens if a ex korean insei starts living for 5y in usa, then takes this exam?
]
;B[sl]C[Demon [3d\]: the game is played in North Carolina, transcribed onto tygem and kgs
]
;W[sj]C[Susaku [-\]: hehe it would be interesting to see a ddk make it to pro by luck in every game
Ganymed [7k\]: Hmm, I still get b+6
]
;B[sk]C[Karcusrd [-\]: drug testing would insue
RobertT [-\]: there was a 1-2 dan player that got to the 3rd round because his opponents happened to not show up or he got paired with kyus
Aokame [?\]: you shouldnt troll this game

Karcusrd [-\]: I dont mean USAgo do it someone event it
Hindor [2k\]: Oh, ok
]
;W[dk]
;B[dl]
;W[og]
;B[of]C[Susaku [-\]: i smell tension between the two even here
aceace [2k\]: ;)
Susaku [-\]: that is gunna be one small center though

RiPresent [4k\]: R16 might be nice now
]
;W[cc]
;B[cb]C[opium [?\]: seems like so much 1 pt sente yose available that i dont kmow is wasted threats or aji
]
;W[lh]C[Demon [3d\]: someone event it?
]
;B[lg]C[Susaku [-\]: now center looks big]
;W[kg]C[Karcusrd [-\]: is this game in Mayberry
]
;B[mh]
;W[oh]
;B[cg]
;W[dg]
;B[cj]C[Susaku [-\]: r16 thinking this will be next here soon or defending it
Hedopom [4d\]: B2
Karcusrd [-\]: print them here

Demon [3d\]: Black Mountain I think, where Go Congress is going to be
]
;W[hh]C[Ganymed [7k\]: B2 - C2
Susaku [-\]: dat w looks so good right now
Aokame [?\]: w a-3 pretty big later
opium [?\]: b2 = genius
ThiGar [3k\]: m11
kishiryu [3k\]: w b2...i didnt even notice that
Hellequin [13k\]: i thought about m11 too
Aokame [?\]: ok, i thought about a-3
Rochedale [6k\]: It's a very clever reduction, for sure.
Hedopom [4d\]: B2 7 point
GoGott [4k\]: gote :)
evanj [3d\]: even i saw b2
Susaku [-\]: b2 c2 a3 b1 a4 ?
lexansoft [2k\]: and h12 is just 2 points, so it was mistake?
twoody [5k\]: b2 c2 a3 d1 a4 
ZhengZheng [4k\]: B2's gote
evanj [3d\]: b2 c2 a3 b1 a3
evanj [3d\]: a2*
ZhengZheng [4k\]: he's probably trying to play reverse sente i guess
Susaku [-\]: no need to capture save capture for later
Susaku [-\]: d1 can be saved
Susaku [-\]: like b1
evanj [3d\]: i don't know what you're talking about
Susaku [-\]: not in yours, in twoodys
twoody [5k\]: Ah I see your point. I was doing a rough read of it. That way is much better.
Ganymed [7k\]: L10 maybe?
Susaku [-\]: =3
mateogo [3k\]: L10 only move
Hedopom [4d\]: A4 only move
Monet: b must honte
Lynx [1d\]: A4 looks very important
Susaku [-\]: b2 is better then a4 i think
Arhiman [3d\]: a4 6 points
Hedopom [4d\]: 7
Ganymed [7k\]: honte is so boring :)
ddbriggs [8k\]: SE has W up 4.5, but i think underestimating B's incursion at tengen. I'd say B looks better
Warfreak2 [4d\]: c12 is a funny shape
Warfreak2 [4d\]: work out why b12 is black's sente
RiPresent [4k\]: L11 is interesting
Susaku [-\]: l9  could shrink w center a bit
Ganymed [7k\]: SE is wrong, can't count AGA properly.
LarryG [3d\]: B wins
Arhiman [3d\]: a4
Warfreak2 [4d\]: SE can't count any rules properly
PhilipJFry [3k\]: lol
Karcusrd [-\]: 185 183
Susaku [-\]: se sucks in all cases except after dead stones have been removed
ddbriggs [8k\]: SE ok in this case tho
RiPresent [4k\]: A4 is gote,  wouldnt go for it, sente for white for 2 points i think
ddbriggs [8k\]: except for middle
Arhiman [3d\]: b 90
Hedopom [4d\]: A4 is gote, but 7 point
twoody [5k\]: 4 corner proverb
Susaku [-\]: especially the middle in most cases, since normally the middle is very undecided untill decided
RiPresent [4k\]: 7?
darwold [1k\]: t13 is big reverse sente
RiPresent [4k\]: oh, sorry, indeed.
Ganymed [7k\]: 4 corner prooverb only  applies to hc games
bert [3d\]: a4 8 pts, imo
RiPresent [4k\]: C9 looks like not so bad sente for B,
Hedopom [4d\]: yeah, because B2
Arhiman [3d\]: ah indeed
Karcusrd [-\]: USGO why dont you have the timers on
Susaku [-\]: c9 e11 would be sente indeed
Demon [3d\]: USGO can't play the moves in the exact time the players do
USGO1 [-\]: kept losing internet connection... will catch up on moves in a few minutes
vitamancy [9k\]: if c9 e11 then b12 also sente?
RiPresent [4k\]: white dont really have other sente though, so A4 might be best ...
Karcusrd [-\]: they need to fix that
Susaku [-\]: r16 is w sente isn't it
RiPresent [4k\]: no, since white simply doesn't have to respond,
USGO1 [-\]: consider this the dinner break until I can catch up
RiPresent [4k\]: R16 doesn't seem to servive or i miss somthing ^^
Demon [3d\]: not really...  USGO gives time updates if you ask.  you don't need to know the time of every single move  o.o
RiPresent [4k\]: yes, its seem small but sente
Karcusrd [-\]: record the stone wacs and adjust to local timer
Lacron [1k\]: it's simply impossible with KGS
Susaku [-\]: =3 r16 should be sente or a reduction at the least XD
RiPresent [4k\]: nvm  that :X
RiPresent [4k\]: the timer i mean ^^
Karcusrd [-\]: real time tap is neaded
Demon [3d\]: you can't record the time of every single move when transcribing to kgs.  if you think you can, watch the live feed for eurogotv games and try to do it yourself
Karcusrd [-\]: is this on Eurogo tv?
RiPresent [4k\]: B shouldn't stop R16 either way, should A4 or L11 or maybe if white really have to react C9
Susaku [-\]: demon your asking something only a person would is overly careful could do. Like mr/ mrs perfect or something
Demon [3d\]: no this is usgo.  look up the users eurogotv1, eurogotv2 up to like 6 i think?
Susaku [-\]: 5
Susaku [-\]: i think
Susaku [-\]: 1,2,3,4,6
Demon [3d\]: susaku, i'm telling karcusrd to not ask usgo to have the times on the kgs clock running like as if it was the real game because it's not possible
Susaku [-\]: there is no 5
inago [2k\]: m10 ? ;p
Susaku [-\]: very true demon
inago [2k\]: a4 looks big too

RiPresent [4k\]: i do like B here...
]
;B[gj]C[Karcusrd [-\]: hard wire the timers through a smart phone unlimited plan
Demon [3d\]: easier said than done
Karcusrd [-\]: yes would need new stlye timers with usb link
Susaku [-\]: ....
Susaku [-\]: I'm offically creeped out..
fraud: black is winning right?
Goban [3k\]: game still going?
fraud: yeah
Susaku [-\]: i think it is a close game
fraud: I think
Goban [3k\]: k
fraud: wait...
fraud: then why is the time paused
fraud: it's a 90 each
fraud: maybe they left?
Karcusrd [-\]: its locked
mooooo [5k\]: dont feed the troll
]
;W[mi]C[goejgo [14k\]: hi
]
;B[ck]C[Arhiman [3d\]: b +3-4
]
;W[eh]C[dullah12 [3k\]: i get b+4
]
;B[jj]
;W[qd]
;B[rc]C[goejgo [14k\]: i think fraud is a beginner
]
;W[od]
;B[pe]
;W[ki]
;B[bh]C[Karcusrd [-\]:  W185 B183
ZhengZheng [4k\]: what happened why does the game look different
]
;W[di]C[ZhengZheng [4k\]: bottom left corner
fraud: How do you get these numbers?
]
;B[ji]
;W[jh]
;B[kj]C[Goban [3k\]: b playd a4
]
;W[lj]
;B[pk]
;W[kl]
;B[sg]
;W[sh]
;B[sf]
;W[lm]
;B[kn]
;W[nh]
;B[rd]
;W[pn]
;B[oo]
;W[qn]
;B[rn]
;W[qa]C[dullah12 [3k\]: w win
]
;B[kk]
;W[lk]C[fraud: unless black makes a mistake
]
;B[pj]
;W[pi]C[fraud: dullah check you're chat
]
;B[dc]
;W[ij]
;B[jk]
;W[jm]C[Hellhuman [1d\]: looks cloe
Ganymed [7k\]: b wins, SE loses
Karcusrd [-\]: W182.5 B185
dullah12 [3k\]: w win he did good end game
Hellhuman [1d\]: does w have any thing with k5 c1 ?
]
;B[]C[dullah12 [3k\]: oh
Hellhuman [1d\]: no aji k5 c1?
dullah12 [3k\]: score
USGO1 [-\]: B+1.5
Lynx [1d\]: =(
dullah12 [3k\]: oh
fraud: lol dullah
Hellhuman [1d\]: is he pro toonow?
Lynx [1d\]: a4 was too big
Hellhuman [1d\]: xD
suboch [2k?\]: I knew that Gan will win from the move 1.
fraud: a4?
fraud: what happened at a4?
Goban [3k\]: a4 = win
Ganymed [7k\]: First game, it's 2 out of 3
fraud: oh
fraud: interesting how 7.5 komi is needed for pros
fraud: but weaker players can't have more than 6.5
Ganymed [7k\]: fraud, read the rules. Different counting needs different komi, but it is basically the same. Has nothing to do with strength.
kishiryu [3k\]: what was gans name again
therookie [5k\]: who won?
Demon [3d\]: GO GANSHENG!  =D
]
;W[]TW[ga][ha][ia][ja][ka][la][ma][na][oa][pa][fb][gb][hb][ib][jb][kb][lb][mb][nb][ob][gc][hc][ic][lc][mc][oc][ed][fd][hd][id][kd][ld][md][ee][fe][ge][he][ie][je][ke][le][me][ef][ff][if][kf][fg][hg][jg][dh][ih][kh][ph][qh][rh][ei][li][ni][ri][si][nj][mk][ll][nl][hm][nm][en][gn][hn][fo]TB[aa][ba][ca][sa][ab][sb][sc][ad][qd][sd][ae][qe][re][se][af][bf][ag][ah][ai][aj][ak][bk][fk][al][rl][bm][cm][sm][sn][jo][ko][lo][ro][so][jp][kp][lp][mp][np][op][pp][qp][rp][sp][aq][jq][kq][nq][oq][qq][rq][sq][ar][br][cr][dr][fr][jr][kr][lr][mr][nr][or][pr][qr][rr][sr][as][bs][cs][ds][es][gs][is][js][ks][ls][ms][ns][os][ps][qs][rs][ss])
